. >> $1.3 trillion deficit you definitely need something to bring that deficit down. bring the national debt down at some point down the road. once there is a balanced budget. who knows when that would be. most people assume nothing is going to happen as far as the fiscal cliff is concerned between now and november 6. but afterwards in that lame duck session between november 6 and december 31, something will happen. are you among those who will agree -- agree that the fiscal cliff will be avoided? >> yes. i think it will be avoided. i mean, you know, depends on the election. you know. if governor romney wins it is likely -- would kick the can into next year. leave everything the same for a few months. let -- the new president come into office and get it together. probably in the spring. president obama wins the election, then right after the election, lame duck, the clock will start ticking and he will be under a lot of pressure to do something. let me say one other thing. you know, i think the most likely scenario is that we are actually going to have to go into next